2024 NFL Draft 2nd and 3rd round gamethread: Baruch atah Adonai WITH SPOILERS
- Thread starter tims4wins
- Start date
I’m not trying to speak for SMU but he seemingly just hates the pick. Not sure any id this changes that
1987 comes close, with the disclaimer they had no second. Armstrong first, Perryman at RB 3rd, Gannon 4th. 1978 is the better parallel: Cryder T 1st, Cavanaugh QB 2nd, Pennywell WR 3rd. Could also argue the 1964 AFL draft: Concannon 1st overall (went to the Eagles instead), Jim Kelly TE in the 2nd, Jon Morris at C in the 4th.
SMU, Wolf seemed pretty confident in Caeden Wallace as a guy they WILL be trying at LT. Is there any reason you're so down on him and can you think of why the F.O. would be as confident in that pick - a real sense of his being their guy all along at #68 - as they clearly are?
Which is why 27 spots in the 4-5th rds is largely meaningless. Very good chance the player you want at 108 is going to be there at 140 because boards are so different by then. NE should have risked Polk and dropped back further to get more capital. Extremely high chance Polk would have still been there at 50 and they could have netted 2025 2nd. Far, far more valuable than 27 spots higher on day 3.
Except... Elliot Wolf has a MUCH better idea who else in the league likes a guy than we do, and they didn't think he'd be there at 50. That's the thing, much like how Bellichick has said they were confident last year in Gonzalez because even though they knew WAS might take a CB they knew they liked Forbes more. These guys all have ears out, they have agents and coaches talking to them.
The idea that Wolf trade down 3 picks to take a guy but could have traded down 16 picks and gotten the guy and just was too dumb to realize it, but you sussed it out..... sure.
From the interview it sounded like they liked the player a lot. (Obviously they will say that in any case but it was telling that he kept saying they would have taken him at #34.) Once they got an offer of something they were happy to take it based on intel. Some of the other trades in R2 did net more. Rather than whether they could have moved further back I'd be interested to know how many calls they got for the pick.
Only one other WR went in the 2nd rd after Polk did, AD at 52 so yeah it is more than likely Polk would have been there in the 50s. It is possible Wolfe had bad intel. He was with this FO when they were fooled into thinking PIT was going to take Tyquan Thornton back in 2022 and decided they had to trade up to take him. They aren't infallible.
Were they "fooled" into thinking that or did PIT also actually (and stupidly) want Tyquan?
Sure.. but that's the thing... we can't know, and not taking the guy you want because you HOPE he falls isn't a good strategy and looking at hypothetical trades after the picks are made is pointless. Nobody took a WR.... but that doesn't mean nobody would have taken Polk. Nobody took a QB between 3 and 8 last night, but we know that if Drake Maye wasn't taken at #3 he wasn't getting past 6. Also note that a number of teams traded out of picks after the Patriots, any of those teams may have had Polk on their board high and moved out because he got taken by NE (CAR, WAS, IND, GB)
They will never say but PIT wasted no time taking Pickens, Pickens was far, far higher on the consensus boards so I'd be willing to bet Pickens was always their pick. Tyquan had a 4th-6th rd grade compared to Pickens 2nd.
I mean if we are going to play this game then Wolfe will always be perfect and there is no point in discussing this further. I'm sure their intel is perfect and Wallace was likely the next player that would have been taken at 69.
I think a team that has as many holes as NE does should have risked losing out on Polk who has a capped ceiling for significantly more draft capital if the opportunity was presented. We do know that several teams received more draft capital in the 2nd rd, that isn't disputable. I would have rather NE opted for more draft capital even if it meant risking Polk. Possession receivers are not the end all be all of offense building.
can we just see how these players perform on the field before we slam this draft? It’s one thing to get frustrated with a pattern of behavior by BB, and another to rip this FO for failing before these guys even go to minicamp.
that’s not to say we can’t have a good discussion about it, but some of the freaking out in this thread when Polk might be the best WR picked between 25 and 40 when all is said and done is a bit overboard.
More fun if we talk a bunch of shit and then be ready to apologize or take a victory lap.
Well, yes, we all know that Tyquan was ranked - seemingly correctly - as a Day Three pick, and that Pickens was ranked as a 2nd rounder, pre-draft. No one is disputing that. It's why we were all - ARE all - pissed about what happened. But that's not the same thing as Pittsburgh having somehow head-faked the Pats into drafting him. I recall there being credible rumors after that pick that Pitt genuinely wanted Tyquan. The fact that they "wasted no time taking Pickens" is indicative of pretty much nothing concrete besides the fact that, like many NFL teams, they keep a draft board handy.
ALL of that said...FUCK. Why the FUCK did we not take Pickens like we all wanted???
EDITS for clarity and for having fewer typos.
Of course the Steelers got Roman.
I'd bet a week's pay that Roman has a better career than Polk. We could have had a tier2 tackle at 34 and Roman at 68. I'm confused, but at least we addressed both positions.
This is a very different argument.
If you think Polk is a bad pick and they should have traded down... sure that's a valid argument.
If your argument is they should have traded down AND TAKEN POLK.... that isn't one, because it assumes something that nobody can know.
Like Wallace. It's a whatever pick, it's probably a reach, but they wanted a tackle. I would have much preferred they traded up 10 picks and took Suamataia. If you want to argue they should have traded back, or taken a different player... no worries.
I don't have a problem with arguing that you think they should have traded further back and taken whomever was left, sure. I'm saying I like Polk, they liked Polk, in order to be sure you get Polk you couldn't trade back very far.
I think of what Trevor Sikkema on PFF said about it... he basically said "If you want a guy like Ja'Lynn Polk in the 2nd,.... there really aren't any other guys like him in that range, so you have to be really sure about your evaluation/intel on what other teams need, and who the Chargers are coming up for"
I've said repeatedly Polk is a fine pick but felt he could have been had a bit further down. In my WR ranks I had him with the highest floor in the mid-tier of WRs and had him as a 2nd-3rd rd pick. I don't think he will be the best and I don't think he will be the worst WR in that range. Can't say the same about the OT but I admittedly don't study or pay attention to OL at all.
Kirk Cousins tweet yesterday was probably similar but the follow up would be “yack king”
I mean, we also could have had Polk and the same tackle you wanted at 34 by trading into the late 50s, the first tackle didn't go off the board until 55.
Crazy, I'm not a Franklin guy but he is probably top of my board now because if he hits he has WR 1/2 potential. I think he has a high bust rate but so does everyone in the 4th and later and his ceiling is higher than Polk. His age adjusted production was off the charts and he is very young, just turned 21. If he can add 10lbs of muscle he could be a legit #1. Again I think he has low chance of hitting it but I don't think there is another WR left with his ceiling.
It would be hilarious if we took Franklin at 103... it would be like DET last year... just shuffle the picks around and everyone is happy... Franklin at 34 wouldn't be a reach, Polk at 68... STEAL, Wallace at 103... sure why not?
The problem I have is this: "it's probably a reach, but they wanted a tackle."
It's a sign to me that we got a relatively mediocre front office. Great front offices should go talent first, need second, especially in a rebuild where we're drafting for the future. When you compound this with the fact that it looks like the guys we picked were pretty low ceiling, safe, low ceiling high floor guys, it appears to me that the FO is picking to check all the boxes and to preserve their jobs, not swinging for titles. As much as Bill the GM had issues, no one could doubt he thought he was going for the best player available. I don't get the sense that we're doing that anymore.
Yeah that'd be fine by me. Honestly, I was hoping that they'd do that this year either for tackle or receiver as needed. Was calling for it last year in the thread (to no avail).
Didn't even notice that Franklin was still on the board. Yeah, if we still ended up with him somehow, I'd ask for a threadban in advance of the draft next year just to guarantee no complaints from here.
Feels like a lot of interesting guys left at the top of round 4. Pats could conceivably come away with two of:
RB - Jaylen Wright
WR - Franklin, Baker, Wilson
TE - Sanders, Stover
OL - Christian Jones, SVP
ED - Austin Booker
CB - Tampa, Hart, Jackson
RB - Jaylen Wright
WR - Franklin, Baker, Wilson
TE - Sanders, Stover
OL - Christian Jones, SVP
ED - Austin Booker
CB - Tampa, Hart, Jackson
It's an interesting question. I don't think Polk was checking a box, I think they thought he was the best guy for the team there. Wallace I do think was checking a box, but i have no doubt they think he can be a starter.
I absolutely don't think they are more filling spots than Bill. Bill was notorious in that he picked guys to fit a very specific role he felt the team needed. So he felt he needed a move guard and that would best increase the chances to win games... well you're getting Cole Strange. He needed a deep threat to be a better Agholor... Tyquan Thornton. You need a QB... Mac Jones is the best one left. Bill went with "best impact on the team" not BPA. Like in 2018... no way he thought Sony Michel was the BPA at 31.. but he thought a good rookie RB would have the most impact on the team winning over the next few years.
I think Wolf is going to take what he thinks is the best player in a position that will get playing time. If we had better OT depth... yeah I bet he doesn't take Wallace, but... we just don't have anything long term at LT and not much short term, so a player he thinks can be a starter there... huge value to the team. I would guess that is how he's thinking. If he was trying to save his job.... he's just go consensus, owner isn't going to be mad you took the guy everyone else said was good.
Still mind boggling that he didn’t receive more college interest, especially as a two way star!
Pretty unfair not to allow for the possibility the guys they picked are actually good.
Swinging for titles? It’s two picks deep at this point. How can you make a sweeping statement like that about job preservation based on two picks?
Holy hell this thread is miserable. Glad you joined so you could post that informed opinion.
Yeah, I mean obviously I'm not in the front office, so I can't have a fully-informed view, for all I know, they have these guys as best on the board. However, no one knows what they think, so I'm just going to give my heavily caveats opinion of what it looks like.
With that big caveat, it can't help but seem like they're checking boxes. They did pick two guys at clear positions of need that weren't exactly highly regarded for their upside at the end of positional runs. This was after in the first round there was a huge run on offensive players and a bunch of very highly regarded defenders at impact positions were on the board. I may be overstating it, but these picks kind of make me doubt that they're looking at talent first and then position as the tiebreaker. It looks more like they look at position first and then talent as the tiebreaker
Most front offices in the NFL are mediocre. We had a spectacular run of good decision making until the league seemed to pass Bill by at the end. Odds are, his replacement will be mediocre like most NFL GMs are. I would love to be wrong, and it's way too early to tell, I just don't love what I've seen so far. But it's obviously way too early to tell for sure. For all I know, they had these two guys as the absolute BPA. I just find that somewhat hard to believe.
My assumption is the Steelers felt comfortable with him having no ACL after their experience with Hines Ward. If he never had it his body learned to compensate for it and it shouldn’t be a huge problem.
I would be good with us double-dipping with those two TEs, as long as both signed waivers that they would not kill anyone after signing.
Stick to posts, not posters. Lots of emotional nothingness in this thread on picks that haven't played a single NFL snap.
Let's see what happens.
Let's see what happens.
I feel like McCaffrey is catnip for front offices. Name recognition, QB convert, plays very hard, probably interviews extremely well. He may amount to nothing but he's coming out as kind of an advanced version of Edelman at this point in their careers.
I hope the Pats pick Wilson because I think he would offer them something unique, but I could also get excited about Franklin at this point.
If Wallace can play LT and came in and start Day 1 or even a month into the season no one will give a shit where he was drafted.
First of all, I love that man. Second of all, I am glad to wake up today and learn that he went to a team I’m at least pretty neutral about, and I won’t have to root against him.