Celtics vs Da Culture - Round 1 (FIGHT!)
- Thread starter Ed Hillel
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I saw the clip just now on Twitter: he was really really complimentary of Boston, no injury excuses. I think he was more saying that he wants a break from the NBA in general now that Miami is eliminated, which is...understandable?
He'll be back with Jrue and Tatum on Team USA in just 2 months, so I can understand detoxing from basketball a bit before then.
In their four losses, the Heat averaged 87.5 points per game (94, 84, 88, 84). Even including their win (111 points), they averaged 92.2 points for the series.
The 30th-ranked (bottom) offense of the season, Memphis, scored 105.8 points per game this season.
The last time a team finished under 100 points per game on the season was the 2017-18 Sacramento Kings (98.8).
The last time a team finished under 95 points per game on the season was the 2014-15 NY Knicks (91.9).
The last time a team finished under 90 points per game on the season was the 2011-12 Charlotte Bobcats (87.0).
And those were all the worst teams in the league, not the defending conference champion in the playoffs.
Dean Wade better find his rabbit's foot, and quickly.
I know the playoffs are still going on but given all of our worries about the C's clutch time execution, I thought I'd check out how the Cs are doing statistically.
And wouldn't you know it, BOS is nowhere to be found if one looks at the top 10 for ORtg, DRtg, NetRtg, or any other stat.
Or clutch time minutes played - BOS has 0.0 clutch time minutes so far.
(And just in case anyone is interested, LAC is 1st in ORtg with 176.9 in 7 minutes; OKC is 1st in DRtg at 53.8 in 6 minutes, and MIN is 1st in NetRtg with +57.5 in 3 minutes. Small sample sizes indeed.)
And wouldn't you know it, BOS is nowhere to be found if one looks at the top 10 for ORtg, DRtg, NetRtg, or any other stat.
Or clutch time minutes played - BOS has 0.0 clutch time minutes so far.
(And just in case anyone is interested, LAC is 1st in ORtg with 176.9 in 7 minutes; OKC is 1st in DRtg at 53.8 in 6 minutes, and MIN is 1st in NetRtg with +57.5 in 3 minutes. Small sample sizes indeed.)
This is fantastic. I love the idea of them building around Bam & Herro without picks.
Who is lining up for 35 year old Jimmy Butler who has a 52 million dollar player option for his age 36 season?
Some team that desperately needs a name.
Houston has VanVleet (who's still good at least), Dillon Brooks, Steven Adams, and Jeff Green on payroll next year. Portland is paying big money to Ayton, Jerami Grant, Anfernee Simons, Brogdon, less to Rob Williams, Thybulle. There are some bad contracts in the NBA. Jimmy is what he is, but at least he is good.
Kind of feels like a Mark Cuban move waiting to happen although matching salaries without Kyrie involved would be near impossible for Dallas or would seriously gut their depth.
Wouldn't the thinking be they get some draft picks if they trade Butler? MIA "only" owes a 2024 to OKC and a 2027 to CHA so they do have some picks
Right, and 2025 frees up as soon as the draft is over. Then they have 2025, 2029 and (I think) 2031, plus swaps.
Trade Jimmy to Detroit for some assets/players, and then go get the next Jrue-level guy who's available. Could also do something like S&T Harden if they get under the second apron, I think?
As long as they get something halfway decent for Butler, they have ways to pivot.
They'll absolutely get some, but it won't be a Dame/KD haul unfortunately (or fortunately). Of course they have picks because Stepien. But they're not flush with picks and likely won't be after the hypothetical Butler trade. If they get a first and a swap back for Jimmy plus a mediocre guy and filler, it's a slow rebuild.
3 picks + swaps available to deal is nearly as good as it gets (the max is 4, if we're talking about only your own picks).
They aren't very deep and don't have many really plus players, so it's tough, but they have enough to be in the conversation now, where they didn't really last summer when it was Dame.
They need a new alpha - but Bam, Herro, Jaquez, Jovic etc. is a respectable supporting cast if they find one. Of course, finding your alpha is the toughest thing to do in the NBA....
Here's the video. Love it.
View: https://twitter.com/KevinOConnorNBA/status/1787540876132327653
Pat Riley on Jimmy Butler: “If you're not on the court playing, you should keep your mouth shut.”
View: https://twitter.com/KevinOConnorNBA/status/1787540876132327653
Pat Riley on Jimmy Butler: “If you're not on the court playing, you should keep your mouth shut.”
well i guess implicitly i was limiting down to teams who could realistically made a move for him. which playoff teams have 50 mill of contracts they can move?
Philly has the cap space to trade for him without matching contracts, I believe. If Butler hadn't played there (and left) already, I'd figure that Jimmy would be their #2 target after George.
Butler would be a good fit in Philly.
Can Lakers cobble together the contracts for him? He and Lebron would be...interesting. Instead, maybe Lebron wants back in to South Beach!
NOLA seems like it would at least kick the tires, though he's not a perfect fit next to Zion (then again, the two of them will be healty together rather infrequently anyway)
Can Lakers cobble together the contracts for him? He and Lebron would be...interesting. Instead, maybe Lebron wants back in to South Beach!
NOLA seems like it would at least kick the tires, though he's not a perfect fit next to Zion (then again, the two of them will be healty together rather infrequently anyway)
Philly has cap space.
Chicago and Golden State have ability to trade. Clippers, Milwaukee, Lakers?
I haven’t gone through a team yet that isn’t capable IF they want Jimmy.
Looking at the list of 2025 free agents I also see New Orleans if they wanted to swap Ingram + other shit but not sure if Miami would want that. We also got Indiana with Siakam at 34 million so you'd still need some more to match. OKC has Hayward's contract to move as well.
So.... a lot of teams. Yeah looking at it it looks a lot more plausible than I thought for playoff teams.
Gotta chop off any second apron teams as possibilities though. They can't aggregate salaries to get up to Butlers 49 miilion (I think that is only looking like Boston, Minnesota, and Phoenix though)
And Denver, per Spotrac 24-25 cap numbers. I guess it would depend whether a trade happened in the 23-24 cap year or 24-25.
Philly going balls to the wall to reacquire Jimmy just in time for his body to break down would certainly be the funniest of all possible options.
Seriously. Poor Maxey having to navigate the 70 combined games between Butler and Embiid
Jimmy for Dame...I need some deck chairs to be re-arranged since neither will be available all that much over the next few seasons
I think it happens. Philly. We’ll all get terrified when they start 25-5. Then the injuries will mount.
No one read The Athletic article? Riley was pretty clear they don’t plan to trade Butler, not that that definitely means they wouldn’t.
“Still, Riley was adamant that Butler will not be dealt away.
“No,” Riley said when asked directly about trading him.”
https://theathletic.com/5475423/2024/05/06/jimmy-butler-pat-riley-comments
“Still, Riley was adamant that Butler will not be dealt away.
“No,” Riley said when asked directly about trading him.”
https://theathletic.com/5475423/2024/05/06/jimmy-butler-pat-riley-comments
I mean, his return on the eventual trade would be less if he said "yes", so the game theory here seems straightforward.
I read it, but I don't believe everything I see printed
If you're Riley, realistically, what else are you going to say there? I think for most of us his criticism of Jimmy's comments - which he absolutely did not need to include - spoke loudly. And the reality is Butler just feels old for the rest of the team, so a smart team like the Heat feels likely to explore getting out while there is still value.
We'll see!
He also says anything is on the table and if Jimmy is going to miss so many games they’re not going to pay him.
Cashman was critical of Stanton this winter when he didn't have to be, he is right back in the lineup. I think when execs have been doing the same job as long as Cashman and Riley, sometimes they just go with honesty over what is prudent. Obviously Riley was right, Butler sounds ludicrous talking shit at this point no matter how awesome he was last postseason.
Stanton is a massively negative contract, among the worst in sports. There's little question he was available, but you need someone to want him too.
FWIW, Howard Beck was on the Lowe Post last week and strongly suggested that Jimmy is done in Miami, and that they've been having internal discussions on moving on from him since last summer. Said something to the effect of "there's a lot that comes with dealing w/Jimmy"
Selling 1-year early trips up a lot of NBA teams/fans.I read it, but I don't believe everything I see printed
If you're Riley, realistically, what else are you going to say there? I think for most of us his criticism of Jimmy's comments - which he absolutely did not need to include - spoke loudly. And the reality is Butler just feels old for the rest of the team, so a smart team like the Heat feels likely to explore getting out while there is still value.
We'll see!
Pat Riley can do and say whatever he wants, it's not like he has to cater to a fanbase. At some point, it will be just him & Alonzo suited up, sitting in the first 20 rows.
This is immediately what I thought of when I saw that Riley quote.
It seems like the organization is just kind of sick of him
I still remember a Celtics game when Kevin McHale was on as a guest color guy, and in between quarters McHale was hot mic'd saying something (potentially - it wasn't super clear) about Jimmy being an a-hole. Anyone else remember that?
Butler is entering the last year of his contract (with the following year being a player option). Riley is not going to let the salary slot and trade chit walk out the door in 2025 for nothing, and sign-and-trade transactions have essentially been made impossible with the new CBA. So, the most logical choice for the Heat is to find suitors for Butler, of which there will be plenty.
I would be surprised if there is an extension out there that works out finacially for Butler so I think we need to just think of this a 2 year deal
That's kinda how Riley put in his press conference:
“We don’t have to do that for a year. So we have not discussed that internally right now,” Riley said during his 43-minute season-ending news conference Monday afternoon. “But we have to look at that, making that kind of commitment and when do we do it. We don’t have to do it until 2025 actually. But we’ll see. We haven’t made a decision on it, and we really haven’t in earnest discussed it. So we’ll just see what happens.”
Riley is right, the window to sign Butler to that extension opens July 7 and doesn’t close until June 30, 2025.
The issue is that Butler and his camp will push for that extension before the start of the upcoming season, according to a league source. Choosing not to offer this exact extension this offseason could lead to a disgruntled Butler.
“I mean, if he requests, we can either accept or we can say we’re going to think about it,” Riley said when asked what the Heat will do if Butler requests the extension this offseason. “But we have not made a decision on it. I think you make too much out of this. He still has two years left on his contract, theoretically. He’s got a player option. But that’s something that we have to give some real thought to based on a lot of factors. ... That’s a big decision on our part to commit those kinds of resources unless you’re somebody who’s really going to be there, available every single night. That’s the truth.”
Read more at: https://www.miamiherald.com/sports/nba/miami-heat/article288319460.html#storylink=cpy
I think no one in PHI right now has any issues with Butler and I believe Embiid has a good relationship with him.
I mean they'd trade Tobias Harris for him if they could.
In a similar vein, BOS could probably trade JB for him.
Where is Udonis Haslem sitting, then !!!!!!Selling 1-year early trips up a lot of NBA teams/fans.
Pat Riley can do and say whatever he wants, it's not like he has to cater to a fanbase. At some point, it will be just him & Alonzo suited up, sitting in the first 20 rows.
Part of the reason Jimmy floated around so much (chicago/Minny/philly) is he's a demanding personality. There's ways that can help a team, but it tends to get old as we saw with the less-impactful Grant here.
There may not be a deal out there which makes sense for Miami - cap-wise and asset-wise but I do think they are going to explore moving him given the chatter and that press conference.