AlNipper49 said:David Ortiz is now tied with JD Drew for most career postseason hits which either tied or put the team ahead with 5. (From Edes' column)
AlNipper49 said:David Ortiz is now tied with JD Drew for most career postseason hits which either tied or put the team ahead with 5. (From Edes' column)
Lose Remerswaal said:
Tied with JD Drew with 5, but Pete Rose and Bernie Williams each have 6.
sfip said:How close Torii Hunter was to catching it.
DukeSox said:No, there was lots of gap between ball and glove, just a tricky angle.
DrewDawg said:
Well, it's not quite as close as that angle makes it look, but it was pretty damn close. He overran it.
sfip said:How close Torii Hunter was to catching it.
Nope .. It's a catch .. It's probably happened hundreds of timesterrisus said:Over-ran it just a little bit, and had to reach backwards to try to get it.
Ifhe hadn't over-ran it, he might have had it.
Of course, if he falls into the bullpen with the ball, isn't it still a home run anyway?
BCsMightyJoeYoung said:Nope .. It's a catch .. It's probably happened hundreds of times
There were two outs at the time .. The inning would have been over with Hunter making an all time great catch and no runs scoredterrisus said:5.10(f) When a fielder, after catching a fly ball, falls into a bench or stand, or falls across
ropes into a crowd when spectators are on the field. As pertains to runners, the provisions
of 7.04(c) shall prevail.
7.04(c) A fielder, after catching a fly ball, falls into a bench or stand, or falls across ropes
into a crowd when spectators are on the field;
Rule 7.04(c) Comment: If a fielder, after having made a legal catch, should fall into a stand
or among spectators or into the dugout or any other out-of-play area while in possession of the ball
after making a legal catch, or fall while in the dugout after making a legal catch, the ball is dead and
each runner shall advance one base, without liability to be put out, from his last legally touched base
at the time the fielder fell into, or in, such out-of-play area.
Alright, maybe not a home run, but still.
KillerBs said:Papi's biggest post season HR ever? And is that saying something. One could debate it with the walk off in the 12th in Game 4 of the 2004 ALCS. But 45% WPA, is tough to beat.
I don't think you can assume that if Hunter got a glove on it he would have completed the catch. He hit the bullpen wall pretty hard, I think there would have been a good possibility that he would have dropped the ball on impact or during the flip.terrisus said:
Over-ran it just a little bit, and had to reach backwards to try to get it.
If he hadn't over-ran it, he might have had it.
Of course, if he falls into the bullpen with the ball, isn't it still a home run anyway?
I think the victory cop would have tasered him at that pointProdigal Sox said:I don't think you can assume that if Hunter got a glove on it he would have completed the catch. He hit the bullpen wall pretty hard, I think there would have been a good possibility that he would have dropped the ball on impact or during the flip.
doc said:I think the victory cop would have tasered him at that point
Was there a reply? Fox showed several different angles of the play but I don't recall them showing one where you could see him hitting the ground.joe dokes said:would it have been a reviewable "boundary play," such that the umps could look at a replay and see if it came out of his golve when he slammed into earth?
doc said:I think the victory cop would have tasered him at that point
JimBoSox9 said:I can't honestly conceive of a scenario that would top '04 game 4. Those of us who were present must hold the line as time dilutes public perception of those events.
Philip Jeff Frye said:Was there a reply? Fox showed several different angles of the play but I don't recall them showing one where you could see him hitting the ground.
KillerBs said:if we assume all the play-off games are 50-50 propositions, on a strict World Series championship probability added basis, last night's slam clearly surpasses the 2004 Game 4 winner, which acc. to bbref, clocks in at +27 WPA, getting us from 0% chance to a 6.1% chance for the World Series win...0.27 x 6.1 == WSPA of 1.6% or so.
If my rough calculations are right, last night, Ortiz's HR contributed 45% of our movement from 9.4% to 25% chance of winning the world series, or 7% increase in our WS odds, in one swing of the bat.
On an emotional basis, given "the curse," the Yankees, and other context, I will concede the point.
PedroKsBambino said:
Completely agree---there have been some amazing moments since then...and none of them are even in the same tier as that game. The feeling when Millar walked---then the steal---the hit. Then the interminable twists and turns before Papi ended it....it is in a class all its own just as a game. When you add in the contextual drama ('1918', Sox/Yankees, the start of 0-3 comeback) it is so high a bar it is very difficult to imagine it ever being matched.
Hunter over-running it helped him miss it. I'm reminded of Dewey's recollection of catching Joe Morgan's ball- he said 9999 times out of 10,000 when a ball is hit like that into right field, it tails towards the foul pole, but Morgan's didn't, but Dewey said he threw up his glove and caught it anyway. Tizzle's ball clearly tailed a little to right, and Hunter misjudged it enough, over running it a bit, to miss it by a bit more.terrisus said:
Over-ran it just a little bit, and had to reach backwards to try to get it.
If he hadn't over-ran it, he might have had it.
Of course, if he falls into the bullpen with the ball, isn't it still a home run anyway?
JimBoSox9 said:I can't honestly conceive of a scenario that would top '04 game 4. Those of us who were present must hold the line as time dilutes public perception of those events.
I was at game 4 and remember thinking as game 5 ended that it was even better than game 4. Perhaps it was in part because, even after game 4, I did not think that the Sox had a chance. After game 5, I did.cannonball 1729 said:
I can only think of one scenario that measures up to '04 Game 4. And that would be '04 Game 5.
glasspusher said:Although in fairness to Hunter, that was a low line shot, and he had about zero time to think about it, I'm sure. The fact he got near it is a testament to his ability.
KillerBs said:Papi's biggest post season HR ever? And is that saying something. One could debate it with the walk off in the 12th in Game 4 of the 2004 ALCS. But 45% WPA, is tough to beat.
PedroKsBambino said:Completely agree---there have been some amazing moments since then...and none of them are even in the same tier as that game. The feeling when Millar walked---then the steal---the hit. Then the interminable twists and turns before Papi ended it....it is in a class all its own just as a game. When you add in the contextual drama ('1918', Sox/Yankees, the start of 0-3 comeback) it is so high a bar it is very difficult to imagine it ever being matched.
Love the beardDeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
The whole sequence is just remarkable. Ortiz sitting on the first pitch, Benoit missing by just a little, Hunter nearly making yet another of his HR-saving catches (as a side note, imagine what sort of tongue bath McBuck would be giving Torii for the rest of this series had he snagged it) and then the bullpen cop.
I know this is an Ortiz thread but Steven Horgan needs some love here too. If the Sox win the ALCS, this image will almost certainly be iconic. Hell, I want a t-shirt.
canyoubelieveit said:Hold on, that can't be right. I can think of 6 for Ortiz off the top of my head:
1. The walkoff homerun against the Angels (Jarrod Washburn)
2. A basehit to put the Sox up 3-2 against the Yankees in game 4 of the 2004 ALCS (El Duque)
3. The walkoff homerun against Quantrill in game 4
4. The walkoff hit against Loaiza in game 5
5. The homerun against Kevin Brown in the first inning of game 7
6. Last night's grand slam
glasspusher said:Hunter over-running it helped him miss it. I'm reminded of Dewey's recollection of catching Joe Morgan's ball- he said 9999 times out of 10,000 when a ball is hit like that into right field, it tails towards the foul pole, but Morgan's didn't, but Dewey said he threw up his glove and caught it anyway. Tizzle's ball clearly tailed a little to right, and Hunter misjudged it enough, over running it a bit, to miss it by a bit more.
Although in fairness to Hunter, that was a low line shot, and he had about zero time to think about it, I'm sure. The fact he got near it is a testament to his ability.
canyoubelieveit said:Hold on, that can't be right. I can think of 6 for Ortiz off the top of my head:
1. The walkoff homerun against the Angels (Jarrod Washburn)
2. A basehit to put the Sox up 3-2 against the Yankees in game 4 of the 2004 ALCS (El Duque)
3. The walkoff homerun against Quantrill in game 4
4. The walkoff hit against Loaiza in game 5
5. The homerun against Kevin Brown in the first inning of game 7
6. Last night's grand slam
Last night's Ortiz Grand Slam was the first in the postseason and 8th time in the RetroSheet canon (but probably overall) that four pitchers received earned runs on one play.
"We call Big Papi 'Cooperstown,'" starter Clay Buchholz said. "Whatever he says, everybody listens."
Where did Ortiz learn to orate like that?
"Bill Clinton, he makes a lot of money making speeches," Ortiz said. "And he changes a lot of lives with his speeches. I watch him. I learn. If you can get people to listen, they will react."
"I couldn't understand a thing he said,'' cracked Pedroia.
Wow. Pretty uncanny. Papi's walks are the only major difference.Hank Scorpio said:On Facebook friend referred to Ortiz as the new "Mr. October", to which her Yankee friend replied "oh, please".
So I took the liberty of posting a comparision between him and Reggie Jackson in the postseason.
Edit: These numbers are likely behind two or three days at this point.